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Postby Katto » Mon Sep 17, 2018 5:09 am

What is it about your culture that you treat your prime ministers (who are public servants) like kings?

https://twitter.com/hashtag/HappyBdayPMModi?src=tren

#HappyBdayPMModi trending on twitter

seriously WTF

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Re: Indians

Postby bolero » Mon Sep 17, 2018 9:06 am

Hero worship is in our blood though I am also averse to it.

Modi is a rockstar in India, similar to Tendulkar, one man army.

India's many problems are because of excessive unwanted hero worship.

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Re: Indians

Postby squarecut » Mon Sep 17, 2018 10:23 am

Every Indian PM is not treated like royalty. PMs like Manmohan Singh are deservedly mocked. If Modi is trending on twitter, then I would say that it is because he actually has millions of admirers on twitter. He has 42. 6 million followers on his personal twitter handle and another 26 million followers on his PM handle. He enjoys one of the biggest following on twitter among Leaders. And he fully deserves it.

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Re: Indians

Postby Going South » Mon Sep 17, 2018 5:57 pm

hahahahahaha

when you got billion people who has nothing to do other than pass time on internet everything is a trend.

1% of indian population is equal to entire population of some counties. duh!

yes. indians rule the internet today.
burn !! ;)

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Re: Indians

Postby squarecut » Tue Sep 18, 2018 5:31 am

Fun fact! 22 million passengers travel on Indian Railways at any moment. It is equal to the population of Australia though less than 2 % of Indian population. 330,000 people fly by air in India every day. In Pakistan, supposedly our "arch rival", 180,000 passengers travel by rail in one day and 20000 passengers travel by air daily.

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Re: Indians

Postby Going South » Tue Sep 18, 2018 11:09 am

Image

numbers don’t lie.
most followed, would get most birthday wishes. duh!!

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Re: Indians

Postby Katto » Tue Sep 18, 2018 11:27 am

Trump's birthday doesn't trend

you Indians worship a public servant

for shame!

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Re: Indians

Postby Going South » Tue Sep 18, 2018 12:24 pm

there is one #Happybirthdaytrump
duh!

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Re: Indians

Postby Katto » Tue Sep 18, 2018 12:36 pm

Going South wrote:there is one #Happybirthdaytrump
duh!


yeah one, probably from himself

not trending

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Indians

Postby Going South » Tue Sep 18, 2018 2:01 pm

not now. today is not his birthday. duh!

check stats on obama birthday

#happybirthdayobama

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Re: Indians

Postby Katto » Wed Sep 19, 2018 1:29 am

Going South wrote:not now. today is not his birthday. duh!

check stats on obama birthday

#happybirthdayobama


obama has bots that wish him happy birthday

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Postby Going South » Wed Sep 19, 2018 11:51 am

Katto wrote:
Going South wrote:not now. today is not his birthday. duh!

check stats on obama birthday

#happybirthdayobama


obama has bots that wish him happy birthday

oh. there are many real ppl who think obama is a reincarnation of god. He got one of highest twitter follower count.

the disease is not indian specific, but worldwide.

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Re: Indians

Postby raja » Tue Oct 02, 2018 3:16 pm

Indians are used to being ruled.
Earlier by Maharajas, Nawabs and Nizams - later by the British.
That mentality has not gone to this day.
So even today, most Indians have a serf mentality - only the rulers have changed, from British to Indian rulers.
Yes, rulers.
Indians are used to saying "Congress ruled India" or "BJP rules India".
They don't say "Congress governed India" or "BJP governs India".

You will see the following common serf characteristics amongst many Indians:
- not daring to question the boss
- sucking up to the boss

So chances are you end up with more autocratic, unaccountable bosses, whose ego is fed by a coterie of yes-men and sycophants.

Not saying this only in the context of PM Modi. It existed already in the time of Indira Gandhi, more than 40 years ago.

Technically, the PM of a country is a public servant - and is accountable to the public.
But in serf-country, politicians enjoy huge amounts of power, distributing largesse (all public money) to public through various welfare schemes - thereby buying loyalty of the public, and making them further serfs. They can hand over business benefits to cronies, thereby ensuring their financia support. Institutions meant to empower the public, and intended to serve as checks on politician power, are deliberately weakened by politician meddling. Questioning your leaders invites wrath of the State.

Thus in theory, though you are a democracy, in practice, you are more of a sham democracy.

Only way out is for Indians to stop being serfs. To question their leaders/elected representatives as one should be able to, in a half-decent democracy.

Again, am saying this not just in the context of India today, but how India has been since the 1970s, at least.
Can't speak for before that - was before my time.

Having said all this, there's nothing wrong in wishing a PM happy birthday. And if it trends, no big deal. The problem is always the "worshipping" aspect. Like bolero said, Indians tend to go overboard in worshipping human beings and putting them on a pedestal - we had the same with Tendulkar a few years ago. :-)

It's all about serfdom.

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Re: Indians

Postby Katto » Wed Oct 03, 2018 1:14 am

raja wrote:Indians are used to being ruled.
Earlier by Maharajas, Nawabs and Nizams - later by the British.
That mentality has not gone to this day.
So even today, most Indians have a serf mentality - only the rulers have changed, from British to Indian rulers.
Yes, rulers.
Indians are used to saying "Congress ruled India" or "BJP rules India".
They don't say "Congress governed India" or "BJP governs India".

You will see the following common serf characteristics amongst many Indians:
- not daring to question the boss
- sucking up to the boss

So chances are you end up with more autocratic, unaccountable bosses, whose ego is fed by a coterie of yes-men and sycophants.

Not saying this only in the context of PM Modi. It existed already in the time of Indira Gandhi, more than 40 years ago.

Technically, the PM of a country is a public servant - and is accountable to the public.
But in serf-country, politicians enjoy huge amounts of power, distributing largesse (all public money) to public through various welfare schemes - thereby buying loyalty of the public, and making them further serfs. They can hand over business benefits to cronies, thereby ensuring their financia support. Institutions meant to empower the public, and intended to serve as checks on politician power, are deliberately weakened by politician meddling. Questioning your leaders invites wrath of the State.

Thus in theory, though you are a democracy, in practice, you are more of a sham democracy.

Only way out is for Indians to stop being serfs. To question their leaders/elected representatives as one should be able to, in a half-decent democracy.

Again, am saying this not just in the context of India today, but how India has been since the 1970s, at least.
Can't speak for before that - was before my time.

Having said all this, there's nothing wrong in wishing a PM happy birthday. And if it trends, no big deal. The problem is always the "worshipping" aspect. Like bolero said, Indians tend to go overboard in worshipping human beings and putting them on a pedestal - we had the same with Tendulkar a few years ago. :-)

It's all about serfdom.


interesting take :think:

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Postby Going South » Wed Oct 03, 2018 3:41 am

lol. raja sure sound like grouchy old man indeed. he lives in own world and refuse to look outside. concept of change is alien to him. never mind. his opinion is his own personal one but not a representation of entire billion indians where i am sure billion-1 would disagree with him. He sure hate anything indian & love everything pakistani be it cricket or any other thing. Take it with pinch of salt.

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Re: Indians

Postby raja » Wed Oct 03, 2018 6:56 am

Going South wrote:lol. raja sure sound like grouchy old man indeed. he lives in own world and refuse to look outside. concept of change is alien to him. never mind. his opinion is his own personal one but not a representation of entire billion indians where i am sure billion-1 would disagree with him. He sure hate anything indian & love everything pakistani be it cricket or any other thing. Take it with pinch of salt.

:lmao:

Yes, I'm a grouchy old man and I live in my own world. :grin:
As for refusing to look outside, and the concept of change being alien to me - I'll let that pass for now.
As for billion-1 Indians disagreeing with me, I couldn't care less. :grin:
Yes, this is only my personal opinion - so please do take it with a pinch of salt. :grin:

But back to what I said, are we denying that most Indians still have serf mentality?
I've seen people throwing themselves at the feet of politicians.
They beg for favours - after all, politicians can make or break people in India.
And woe betide you if you rub a politician the wrong way - he can make your life miserable.
They enjoy huge power - so much for being "public servants"!

Is this, or is this not, true?

Sham democracy.

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Postby Going South » Wed Oct 03, 2018 1:31 pm

no. that falling over politician feet ass licking is universal concept not just india. Doing namaste & touching feet of elders is a hindu custom. Shaking hands is an English custom. Hug & kiss are muslim customs. If you don’t have problem with other two, you should not have problem with indians ones too, unless you are an indian/hindu hater. Think of it as hand getting kissed of an Italian mafia don by followers to show loyalty, tamil style. Instead of feet getting touched, the same politician when not in power would get kicked around. What goes around comes around. The concept here is that it’s not towards the person but it’s towards the CHAIR. Everyone is an opportunist, not just indian masses. Do you fall on a politician feet? no? It’s akin to kissing asses. look at who is falling thus. They are mostly underserving crooks that want to gain a foothold backdoor. Same shit happens in USA too. Look at people supporting/backing Donald trump in-spite of his many shortcomings. How different is that from falling on his feet? oh, just because it’s indian tradition it becomes an automatic hate worthy thing? Do I belittle the country USA? no. Same thing happened when OBAMA was president. you need to accept that it is what it-is at face value. Have a big heart. See the big picture. Never belittle a country or its tradition.

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Re: Indians

Postby Katto » Wed Oct 03, 2018 1:43 pm

Going South wrote:no. that falling over politician feet ass licking is universal concept not just india. Doing namaste & touching feet of elders is a hindu custom. Shaking hands is an English custom. Hug & kiss are muslim customs. If you don’t have problem with other two, you should not have problem with indians ones too, unless you are an indian/hindu hater. Think of it as hand getting kissed of an Italian mafia don by followers to show loyalty, tamil style. Instead of feet getting touched, the same politician when not in power would get kicked around. What goes around comes around. The concept here is that it’s not towards the person but it’s towards the CHAIR. Everyone is an opportunist, not just indian masses. Do you fall on a politician feet? no? It’s akin to kissing asses. look at who is falling thus. They are mostly underserving crooks that want to gain a foothold backdoor. Same shit happens in USA too. Look at people supporting/backing Donald trump in-spite of his many shortcomings. How different is that from falling on his feet? oh, just because it’s indian tradition it becomes an automatic hate worthy thing? Do I belittle the country USA? no. Same thing happened when OBAMA was president. you need to accept that it is what it-is at face value. Have a big heart. See the big picture. Never belittle a country or its tradition.


not true, unless you're talking about lobbyists, but they have their own agenda and that usually involves some $$$

as for the great unwashed...no, not in my country, ...politicians are regarded one of the lowest forms of life

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Re: Indians

Postby Going South » Wed Oct 03, 2018 2:06 pm

Not just lobbyists. i mean look at all those “great people” eager & falling over themselves to support judge Kavanaugh.

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Re: Indians

Postby Katto » Thu Oct 04, 2018 1:26 am

Going South wrote:Not just lobbyists. i mean look at all those “great people” eager & falling over themselves to support judge Kavanaugh.


he's not a politician, I don't see how that circus is relevant to anything here

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Re: Indians

Postby raja » Thu Oct 04, 2018 3:32 pm

Going South wrote:no. that falling over politician feet ass licking is universal concept not just india. Doing namaste & touching feet of elders is a hindu custom. Shaking hands is an English custom. Hug & kiss are muslim customs. If you don’t have problem with other two, you should not have problem with indians ones too, unless you are an indian/hindu hater. Think of it as hand getting kissed of an Italian mafia don by followers to show loyalty, tamil style. Instead of feet getting touched, the same politician when not in power would get kicked around. What goes around comes around. The concept here is that it’s not towards the person but it’s towards the CHAIR. Everyone is an opportunist, not just indian masses. Do you fall on a politician feet? no? It’s akin to kissing asses. look at who is falling thus. They are mostly underserving crooks that want to gain a foothold backdoor. Same shit happens in USA too. Look at people supporting/backing Donald trump in-spite of his many shortcomings. How different is that from falling on his feet? oh, just because it’s indian tradition it becomes an automatic hate worthy thing? Do I belittle the country USA? no. Same thing happened when OBAMA was president. you need to accept that it is what it-is at face value. Have a big heart. See the big picture. Never belittle a country or its tradition.


Touching feet of elders is indeed a common practice and show of respect in India.
But that's not what I'm talking about.
I'm talking about falling at the feet, obsequiousness of a stomach-churning sickening degree.
No wonder politicians lord over them.

Serfs in a sham democracy.
They can't even question their own elected representatives.

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Re: Indians

Postby bolero » Fri Oct 05, 2018 4:50 am

I am always wary of our politicians cutting across party lines. Cannot trust them fully.

Something is said for public consumption, reality is something else.

The Indian politician has a habit of speaking with a forked tongue. Even among a really bad lot, a good number like Modi or say Kejriwal or some rarity.

They consider them better than the bad lot, the lowest common denominator.

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Re: Indians

Postby Going South » Fri Oct 05, 2018 5:46 pm

kejriwal? he is #1 crook of India. worst ever politician.

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Re: Indians

Postby bolero » Sat Oct 06, 2018 4:08 am

Going South wrote:kejriwal? he is #1 crook of India. worst ever politician.


I consider Kejriwal a crook (speaks with a forked tongue) but many others have hope in him. Thats why AAP swept to power in Delhi.

I am talking about general opinion.

Similarly Modi has both staunch followers and hardcore critics.

There is no in between opinion.

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Re: Indians

Postby raja » Sun Oct 07, 2018 4:55 pm


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Re: Indians

Postby Going South » Sun Oct 07, 2018 10:49 pm

hahaha. i read it. fkkking gutka company. they had arranged prostates also for each of 1200 men onboard says it all how rich these gutka business is in india. man. last year only i went on karibbean cruise. could have been a free trip. ;)

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Re: Indians

Postby raja » Thu Oct 11, 2018 6:47 am

Interesting that India figures in this list at No.6.

https://theprint.in/economy/these-are-t ... ry/132589/

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Postby Going South » Thu Oct 11, 2018 10:05 am

US of A is not the best place to live ? not in top 10? awwww.

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Re: Indians

Postby raja » Tue Oct 16, 2018 7:21 am

Always liked Mike Hussey. :-)
Like him even more now. :-)
https://twitter.com/BattiFull/status/10 ... 7498129408

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Re: Indians

Postby Going South » Tue Oct 16, 2018 9:38 pm

hmmmm
what about first tour of pakistan ?

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Re: Indians

Postby Katto » Wed Oct 17, 2018 2:10 am

Pakistan before 9/11 was probably better

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Re: Indians

Postby Going South » Wed Oct 17, 2018 4:45 am

If i visit any Australian city and i might as well find 1000 things wrong about australia also and might as well write a book too dissing australia no big deal. this go for any country in general.

if hussey wrote a book on dissing india and pakistan but you highlight only those things about india alone that hussey hates, that just show your shared hatred & your agenda to find every opportunity to belittle india in general just because you hate BCCI? slow clap.

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Re: Indians

Postby Katto » Wed Oct 17, 2018 1:26 pm

Going South wrote:If i visit any Australian city and i might as well find 1000 things wrong about australia also and might as well write a book too dissing australia no big deal. this go for any country in general.

if hussey wrote a book on dissing india and pakistan but you highlight only those things about india alone that hussey hates, that just show your shared hatred & your agenda to find every opportunity to belittle india in general just because you hate BCCI? slow clap.


I'm going to assume raja probably loves his country of origin as much as you if not more...but criticism is out of love because no country is perfect and no place can improve without criticism.

As we get older we all get more cynical and see everything for what it really is and this manifests in more criticism.

I criticise my country as much as anybody, but not so much here as not much point with small audience.
You take criticism of India too personally and raja probably likes to exploit this :)

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Postby Going South » Wed Oct 17, 2018 2:57 pm

i have a problem with selective criticism with an agenda. we call it “HATE”.

A moron is a moron however you look at it.

I don’t propagate hate. I will defend if someone spew hatred unwarranted REPEATEDLY. big difference. Once in a while i take a pinch of salt but if you see a repeated hate pattern, it’s moronic & I have zero tolerance if found.

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Re: Indians

Postby Katto » Wed Oct 17, 2018 9:37 pm

Image

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Re: Indians

Postby raja » Tue Oct 23, 2018 10:24 am

Katto wrote:I'm going to assume raja probably loves his country of origin as much as you if not more...but criticism is out of love because no country is perfect and no place can improve without criticism.

As we get older we all get more cynical and see everything for what it really is and this manifests in more criticism.

I criticise my country as much as anybody, but not so much here as not much point with small audience.
You take criticism of India too personally and raja probably likes to exploit this :)


No, I don't think I love India anywhere close to how much GS loves it.
Or most other Indians.
They are nationalistic and patriotic - I am not.

I do love India a lot - but I wouldn't call myself nationalistic or patriotic. I don't even feel any great pride when the national anthem is played, or the national flag is unfurled on Independence or Republic Day.
To me, this is all symbolism that is supposed to make Indians proud of their nation.
A nation which, after the British left in 1947, Indians took over to loot fellow Indians.
Looting that continues to this day.

The Founding Fathers of the nation had great dreams - they had made great sacrifices to get freedom from the British.
Indians of later generations have badly let them down.
Justice, Liberty, Equality (of opportunity), Fraternity - all values that have been enshrined in the Constitution of India - lie in tatters.

All of this bothers me.

Which is why I don't celebrate the great civilisation that India is.

The day these values start getting reflected in society, I will applaud that India.

I don't hate India - I'm just not happy with where it is now.

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Re: Indians

Postby Katto » Tue Oct 23, 2018 1:03 pm

raja wrote:
Katto wrote:I'm going to assume raja probably loves his country of origin as much as you if not more...but criticism is out of love because no country is perfect and no place can improve without criticism.

As we get older we all get more cynical and see everything for what it really is and this manifests in more criticism.

I criticise my country as much as anybody, but not so much here as not much point with small audience.
You take criticism of India too personally and raja probably likes to exploit this :)


No, I don't think I love India anywhere close to how much GS loves it.
Or most other Indians.
They are nationalistic and patriotic - I am not.

I do love India a lot - but I wouldn't call myself nationalistic or patriotic. I don't even feel any great pride when the national anthem is played, or the national flag is unfurled on Independence or Republic Day.
To me, this is all symbolism that is supposed to make Indians proud of their nation.
A nation which, after the British left in 1947, Indians took over to loot fellow Indians.
Looting that continues to this day.

The Founding Fathers of the nation had great dreams - they had made great sacrifices to get freedom from the British.
Indians of later generations have badly let them down.
Justice, Liberty, Equality (of opportunity), Fraternity - all values that have been enshrined in the Constitution of India - lie in tatters.

All of this bothers me.

Which is why I don't celebrate the great civilisation that India is.

The day these values start getting reflected in society, I will applaud that India.

I don't hate India - I'm just not happy with where it is now.


pride and love are two different things

GS does pride in a big way. I'm not going to get into psychoanalyzing the reasons.

Love is what we feel for our family. They annoy us at times and often fail to meet expectations, but they are our family.

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Re: Indians

Postby raja » Tue Oct 23, 2018 2:30 pm

Well put, Katto.
I didn't think of it that way.

If we're talking pride and love, I can say I do love India but I'm not proud of it.

And I'm not going to build up a great image of India to the outside world, hiding its real issues.

This is not to say that everything about India is bad.

Certainly not.

India is fairly diverse in terms of its people - from Kashmir in the north to Kerala in the south, from Gujarat in the west to Manipur in the east.
SO many different cultures, practices, languages, cuisines.
Different religions - Although predominantly Hindu, India has the second largest Muslim population in the world, after Indonesia.
A fair number of Christians too.
In a lot of places, you will find a temple, mosque and church next to each other.
In Bangalore itself there are a few places like this.
Talking of diversity, there's also nature in its diversity.

I love all this about India.
And a few other things too.

So I'm not all negative about the country. :-)

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Re: Indians

Postby raja » Wed Oct 24, 2018 3:21 am

And maybe just cos I value this diversity so much, I'm quite protective of it too. :-)

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Re: Indians

Postby Katto » Wed Oct 24, 2018 9:10 am

not so much diversity in Pakistan though and there lies the rub

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Re: Indians

Postby bolero » Wed Oct 24, 2018 9:34 am


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Re: Indians

Postby squarecut » Wed Oct 24, 2018 11:58 am

There are lots of people who are burden on the country. I call them rent seekers. But still the country is making progress, so there must be people who are helping the country grow. I call such people nation builders. Seeing that the economy of India has quadrupled in last fifteen years, one must conclude that nation builders in India have an upperhand over rent seekers in India. It is easy to criticise the rent seekers, but I expect that one should praise the nation builders as well. Painting everyone in India as a rent seeker is not correct.

Taking pride in good things in India is not jingoism, it is pride in one's achievements. Some of the acievements are truly spectacular. For instance, a country which has a population bigger than any other continent, with each of its state the size of countries, functioning well is a modern miracle. Just try unifying the entire Africa continent into a single nation and run it as a country. Running India successfully as a nation, keeping this huge population united is like that. An all time man made wonder in human history.

It is this country where persecuted people have been welcomed and sheltered throughout history. Christians during the earlier years of this religion, Zorastrians, recently Tibetans- all of them found shelter in India.

Saying that India has nothing to offer and that India has offered nothing or that it will offer nothing in future and at the same time finding great merits in the activities of countries like Pakistan etc can only be an act of being deliberately naive.

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Re: Indians

Postby Going South » Wed Oct 24, 2018 1:19 pm

India is a hindu country. Over years muslims and christians tried to conquer it and outsider foreigners ruled it. In the process they did many unspeakable atrocities and genocide of locals. Hindu genocide in India by outsiders is 100 times more than what you saw during WW2 what nazi did against jews. yet, world don’t care. Even today many muslim madrasas and christian missionaries work illegally aim to bribe to covert or kill locals to increase their numbers exponentially funded by foreign sources. There is a race to increase non-hindu numbers in india, last 2 decades saw exponential growth 300% thanks to lax governments following free-for-all law-less democracy. Already 8 states of India got hindus as minority. I think this decades of tolerance has reached its threshold during current right-wing rulers as they started saying enough is enough, conflict arise and that is what you see today. I expect more rough times in future.

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Re: Indians

Postby Katto » Wed Oct 24, 2018 1:26 pm

squarecut wrote:There are lots of people who are burden on the country. I call them rent seekers. But still the country is making progress, so there must be people who are helping the country grow. I call such people nation builders. Seeing that the economy of India has quadrupled in last fifteen years, one must conclude that nation builders in India have an upperhand over rent seekers in India. It is easy to criticise the rent seekers, but I expect that one should praise the nation builders as well. Painting everyone in India as a rent seeker is not correct.

Taking pride in good things in India is not jingoism, it is pride in one's achievements. Some of the acievements are truly spectacular. For instance, a country which has a population bigger than any other continent, with each of its state the size of countries, functioning well is a modern miracle. Just try unifying the entire Africa continent into a single nation and run it as a country. Running India successfully as a nation, keeping this huge population united is like that. An all time man made wonder in human history.

It is this country where persecuted people have been welcomed and sheltered throughout history. Christians during the earlier years of this religion, Zorastrians, recently Tibetans- all of them found shelter in India.

Saying that India has nothing to offer and that India has offered nothing or that it will offer nothing in future and at the same time finding great merits in the activities of countries like Pakistan etc can only be an act of being deliberately naive.


Pride is the deadliest sin in Christianity because it leads to all the other sins

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Re: Indians

Postby Katto » Wed Oct 24, 2018 1:27 pm

Going South wrote:India is a hindu country. Over years muslims and christians tried to conquer it and outsider foreigners ruled it. In the process they did many unspeakable atrocities and genocide of locals. Hindu genocide in India by outsiders is 100 times more than what you saw during WW2 what nazi did against jews. yet, world don’t care. Even today many muslim madrasas and christian missionaries work illegally aim to bribe to covert or kill locals to increase their numbers exponentially funded by foreign sources. There is a race to increase non-hindu numbers in india, last 2 decades saw exponential growth 300% thanks to lax governments following free-for-all law-less democracy. Already 8 states of India got hindus as minority. I think this decades of tolerance has reached its threshold during current right-wing rulers as they started saying enough is enough, conflict arise and that is what you see today. I expect more rough times in future.


the British empire doesn't have a state religion


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Re: Indians

Postby Going South » Wed Oct 24, 2018 2:38 pm

Katto wrote:
Going South wrote:India is a hindu country. Over years muslims and christians tried to conquer it and outsider foreigners ruled it. In the process they did many unspeakable atrocities and genocide of locals. Hindu genocide in India by outsiders is 100 times more than what you saw during WW2 what nazi did against jews. yet, world don’t care. Even today many muslim madrasas and christian missionaries work illegally aim to bribe to covert or kill locals to increase their numbers exponentially funded by foreign sources. There is a race to increase non-hindu numbers in india, last 2 decades saw exponential growth 300% thanks to lax governments following free-for-all law-less democracy. Already 8 states of India got hindus as minority. I think this decades of tolerance has reached its threshold during current right-wing rulers as they started saying enough is enough, conflict arise and that is what you see today. I expect more rough times in future.


the British empire doesn't have a state religion

what a joke. It’s the missionaries that first go to foreign lands in guise of trade who later turn to usurp land and country.
they dance to Vatican tunes.


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Re: Indians

Postby raja » Wed Oct 24, 2018 5:47 pm

Yes, it is a miracle that India, with all its diversity, is still one nation.
Credit for that should go first to India's Founding Fathers who did their utmost to ensure India remained one, and did not break up into fragments, once the British left.
The initial years after independence were very challenging.
Lot of tension between Hindus and Muslims in India, between India and Pakistan.
Scars of partition.
Massive poverty everywhere.
Massive illiteracy.
Outbreak of disease.
Even Life magazine in the early years expressed doubts whether India would even survive.

And yet the Founding Fathers overcame all this.
They gave us a Constitution which not only has a vision of India but also lays down guiding principles of engagement between the state and its citizens, and between citizens themselves. From the Constitution come citizens' fundamental rights and duties.
The organs of the state, their structure and responsibilities, institutions set up under the Constitution to protect citizens' interests, all of this we have to thank the Constitution for.
It has helped India remain a democracy.
Sure it's far from perfect, and has been amended several times to reflect changing mores of society.
And that's fine - it needs to be a live document.
As long as these changes are progressive, am fine with them.

So I will give a lot of credit to the Founding Fathers.
Subsequent governments have largely ensured that this has continued.
There have been challenges from time to time, there still are, but today's India is much stronger and far more resilient than the India of 70 years ago.

----

I don't agree that India is a Hindu country. India, right from its birth in August 1947, has had Hindus, Muslims, Christians, Sikhs, Buddhists, Jews living side by side. Yes, Hindus are in a majority but it was always meant to be a pluralistic state. Unlike Pakistan, whose very raison d'etre is based on perceived need to provide a home to Muslims.

Which is why Pakistan is called the Islamic Republic of Pakistan.
But India is not called the Hindu Republic of India.

And I am glad it isn't.
Many Muslims who had a choice of going to Pakistan, post-partition, chose to stay in India.
They trusted the pluralistic nature of India.
It would be a betrayal of this trust if they were to be treated as second-class citizens in their own country.
Surely every Muslim is as much Indian as every Hindu here?

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Indians

Postby Going South » Wed Oct 24, 2018 6:22 pm

ofcourse. it’s for everyone today.
if once 100% hindi india went on to become 60% hindu at partition (undivided) where only muslim nations came out india why not hindu nation (?) then same trend followed after many muslims left for pakistan and bangladesh every decade saw reduction.
what was law doing on christian forced conversions & muslim eradication/ethnic cleansing of hindus from places like kashmir? what did founding fathers do? that’s right. NOTHING. Lame ducks. As they are muslim/christian party leaders of congress party, they cared two hoots. Most of non hindus wear hindu name masks to get votes. gandhi dynasty is the nastiest one ever to rule india. blame it.

question:
why do only hindus get to convert to other religions ? why one way traffic ? are they easy target ? hindus remind of jews on many ways, but without any backbone.